Speaking of points of interest.....

Orange_R said:
should be at the top of Comp, nobody goes there anymore so it would "bring back the business"
Click to expand...
Is Comp still closed at night, would I get busted if I set up at the bottom this weekend and raced up and down???  Just asking for a friend.

 
Cookie said:
Is Comp still closed at night, would I get busted if I set up at the bottom this weekend and raced up and down???  Just asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
Must race side to side in a wheelie... :bag:

 
Cookie said:
Is Comp still closed at night, would I get busted if I set up at the bottom this weekend and raced up and down???  Just asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
the spot lights are gone, so I can't imagine it's still "closed"

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Orange_R said:
some of those hippie chicks are kinda hoooot soooo...
Click to expand...
girl-walks-on-desert-beautiful-600w-1454410277.jpg


 
Lord of the Dunes said:
Exactly. Now if the driver is driving defensively, he wouldn't be speeding in a camping area. He also wouldn't be ripping around a bush he can't see around. In both cases, he would miss the man made death trap, whether it's a merry go round, or a kiddie track.

It's always the driver's fault when they hit something, not the landmark's fault. It doesn't matter if it's a witch's eye, a swing set or a kiddie track. To blame the landmark in the case of a swingset and then turn around and blame the driver in the case of a kiddie track is just plain inconsistent, to put it politely. 
Click to expand...
This argument is invalid. They are not the same. The reality is that the RAMP and the Land Manager knowingly accepts and addresses the features made by riding and mother nature. It does NOT accept and address man-made objects that are placed on public lands. Hitting a kiddie track is the equivalent "at fault" fault to hitting a bush or losing it in the whoops on sand highway.

It has absolutely nothing to do with which is more dangerous. I'd argue that launching off of any number of hundreds of perfectly natural dunes is every bit as dangerous as hitting a kiddie track. What we do is inherently dangerous - it's just that we have the right to do so on OUR land without people placing unnatural objects on it. 

It has nothing to do with driving offensively or defensively... other than 15mph within 50ft of camps and roads there are no regulations, road rules do not apply.  It's not a matter of driver always at fault... it's a matter of authorized recreation on public lands managed through a RAMP in in accordance with regs and guidelines and unauthorized/unpermitted/unmaintained items being placed in the public lands. The people who placed the items there are at fault and if the BLM sanctions/permits it then they are liable.

 
I'm not defending kiddie tracks... I dislike them. I'm simply saying when it comes to liability they are totally and completely different than the manmade destinations.

 
Cookie said:
Is Comp still closed at night, would I get busted if I set up at the bottom this weekend and raced up and down???  Just asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
Only closed on the major holiday weekends. Presidents I believe is one of them.  All other times it is actually open at night.

 
HozayKwarvo said:
This argument is invalid. They are not the same. The reality is that the RAMP and the Land Manager knowingly accepts and addresses the features made by riding and mother nature. It does NOT accept and address man-made objects that are placed on public lands. Hitting a kiddie track is the equivalent "at fault" fault to hitting a bush or losing it in the whoops on sand highway.

It has absolutely nothing to do with which is more dangerous. I'd argue that launching off of any number of hundreds of perfectly natural dunes is every bit as dangerous as hitting a kiddie track. What we do is inherently dangerous - it's just that we have the right to do so on OUR land without people placing unnatural objects on it. 

It has nothing to do with driving offensively or defensively... other than 15mph within 50ft of camps and roads there are no regulations, road rules do not apply.  It's not a matter of driver always at fault... it's a matter of authorized recreation on public lands managed through a RAMP in in accordance with regs and guidelines and unauthorized/unpermitted/unmaintained items being placed in the public lands. The people who placed the items there are at fault and if the BLM sanctions/permits it then they are liable.
Click to expand...
Show me that in writing from the BLM.

The bottom line is if someone normally drives around driving defensively and making sure he can see where he is going, he won't hit any man made hazard, including kiddie tracks or a see saw.

OTOH, if he regularly hits large objects that are bigger than his SxS, then he probably has his helmet on backwards.

:lol:

 
Lord of the Dunes said:
Show me that in writing from the BLM.

The bottom line is if someone normally drives around driving defensively and making sure he can see where he is going, he won't hit any man made hazard, including kiddie tracks or a see saw.

OTOH, if he regularly hits large objects that are bigger than his SxS, then he probably has his helmet on backwards.

:lol:
Click to expand...
I'm basing my responses on knowledge and understanding of federal regulations and how the federal government land managers work, not personal feelings and hypotheticals or invalid comparisons to motor vehicles on roadways. Which part do you want to see in writing? I'm headed out of town this weekend but will cite chapter and verse when I return...

I don't off-road and go to Glamis to drive defensively, just the opposite actually. I'm going to guess if that's your thing you are in the 1% (or less). Fact of the matter is though, it's purely subjective and it doesn't have any bearing whatsoever on this issue.

It isn't just about hitting one of these things in a vehicle... what about a broken femur from the redneck swing, someone flying off the swingset with a poorly timed dismount and breaking something... falling off the teeter-totter and chipping a tooth. Whatever... it doesn't matter. Who is liable for what's out there? Not the individual who put it there... the BLM is. They are using OUR funds and OUR resources to deal with it. Is that how you want YOUR funds spent? Do you want YOUR fees raised so they can deal with this chit? Do you want access to YOUR public land put in jeopardy to have a few man-made destinations and memorials out there?

 
Last edited by a moderator:
HozayKwarvo said:
I'm basing my responses on knowledge and understanding of federal regulations and how the federal government land managers work, not personal feelings and hypotheticals or invalid comparisons to motor vehicles on roadways. Which part do you want to see in writing? I'm headed out of town this weekend but will cite chapter and verse when I return...

I don't off-road and go to Glamis to drive defensively, just the opposite actually. I'm going to guess if that's your thing you are in the 1% (or less). Fact of the matter is though, it's purely subjective and it doesn't have any bearing whatsoever on this issue.

It isn't just about hitting one of these things in a vehicle... what about a broken femur from the redneck swing, someone flying off the swingset with a poorly timed dismount and breaking something... falling off the teeter-totter and chipping a tooth. Whatever... it doesn't matter. Who is liable for what's out there? Not the individual who put it there... the BLM is. They are using OUR funds and OUR resources to deal with it. Is that how you want YOUR funds spent? Do you want YOUR fees raised so they can deal with this chit? Do you want access to YOUR public land put in jeopardy to have a few man-made destinations and memorials out there?
Click to expand...
Who is liable when someone hits a kiddie track?

The dipshit driver.

Who is liable if someone hits a swing set or hurts themselves playing on it?

The dipshit driver.

Using your logic, we should remove all playground equipment in all parks because it's a liability issue. Lord knows we don't want OUR tax dollars spent on buying or maintaining such frivolous stuff, especially if a clumsy kid could get hurt.

Break out the bubble wrap!

:lol:

 
Bansh88 said:
That's not far off.  I work in Parks.  Playgrounds are an extreme liability and people sue constantly.  That's why playgrounds nowadays are short, plastic and caged in.
Click to expand...
and have the repurposed rubber cushy landing pads.  

 
Lord of the Dunes said:
Who is liable when someone hits a kiddie track?

The dipshit driver.

Who is liable if someone hits a swing set or hurts themselves playing on it?

The dipshit driver.

Using your logic, we should remove all playground equipment in all parks because it's a liability issue. Lord knows we don't want OUR tax dollars spent on buying or maintaining such frivolous stuff, especially if a clumsy kid could get hurt.

Break out the bubble wrap!

:lol:
Click to expand...
Read this - and educate yourself on many other handbooks - Handbooks | Bureau of Land Management (blm.gov)
H-1703-5.pdf (blm.gov)

It appears to me that the BLM is required to report issues upstream / their upper mgmt....just like any other federal institution.  picture the head of the BLM at Glamis having to send a detailed report to his mgmt about some dumb ass teater totter, wood swing with razor seats that broke and caused a kids bone to break, etc = and that report keeps going up the chain...every year more reports come, more examples, etc..  Dont you think that would catch more eyes than a picture of a kiddie track?  Give it up, comparing those two is a joke.  Comparing to playgrounds is also a joke - those go through permitting processes, inspections for safety, etc.  Using your logic I should be able to put my own "ride" on a public playground that's built like chit and say it's as a memorial.

Break out the common sense.
 

 
wesinls said:
Read this - and educate yourself on many other handbooks - Handbooks | Bureau of Land Management (blm.gov)
H-1703-5.pdf (blm.gov)

It appears to me that the BLM is required to report issues upstream / their upper mgmt....just like any other federal institution.  picture the head of the BLM at Glamis having to send a detailed report to his mgmt about some dumb ass teater totter, wood swing with razor seats that broke and caused a kids bone to break, etc = and that report keeps going up the chain...every year more reports come, more examples, etc..  Dont you think that would catch more eyes than a picture of a kiddie track?  Give it up, comparing those two is a joke.  Comparing to playgrounds is also a joke - those go through permitting processes, inspections for safety, etc.  Using your logic I should be able to put my own "ride" on a public playground that's built like chit and say it's as a memorial.

Break out the common sense.
 
Click to expand...


Here's a little common sense for you.

Kiddie tracks are man made, just like these memorials. That's a fact, it's sure not the wind making them.

The memorials are also man made.

Now how many people have been killed by hitting one of those memorials? None, so far. Knowing some people, it will happen eventually.

How many people have been severely injured or killed by hitting a kiddie track? Yes, I know they shouldn't have been speeding there, but I'm not their mother.

So thinking logically, the BLM should be more concerned about removing the PROVEN man made hazard out there. That shouldn't even be disputed. 

Should the BLM remove all of those memorials? Sure. Should the BLM remove the man made obstacles that have already killed how many?? Absolutely.

Should people stop putting swing sets out there? Sure. Should they stop making kiddie tracks...

well considering the death toll, what do you think?

:lol:

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top