thermostat for LS Engine

[FOG]

CBM put a freeze plug with a hole when they rebuilt my motor years ago. Handed me some steam port plugs and told me how to burp it. Runs at 180 and I have not had any issues. 

 

[Bobalos]

Ya I think I'm going to get rid of the bypass. I think my steam holes have a hard line on them. I've thought about pulling it before when I was trying to fill but didn't want to mess with it because it runs under the throttle body but now that you mention it maybe I should check to make sure they're not blocked. Red circle is the steam hole you're talking about, right?

View attachment 28264

yes that is the guy.

I just found a picture of what my freeze plug looks like.  I forgot it had it.



the picture with the screw driver shows how far I was digging into it & it was still plugged up.  I ended up digging crap out of it through both sides. 

 

[Fullthrottleguy]

answering a few Q's   There is no reason you cannot use a thermostat - BUT its not needed and it just complicates things in the sand

there is mo magic to a thermostat

For a street car it helps the engine heat up faster for a couple reasons - 1. Its better to warm the engine faster to prevent wear on people that turn the key put the car in gear and go  2. It helps in climates where you use the heater, the car warms up faster  3. they run higher temp thermostats now because it helps emissions  - hotter engines run cleaner (and make less power at some point)

The reasons NOT to run one in a sand car are   1. it makes burping the engine/radiator way harder  - if you don't vacuum fill the engine or play gameswhen filling (as I mentioned above) you have a good chance of getting trapped air.   some trapped air is OK - too much will usually make its way to the water pump and cause cavatation or worse make a hot spot somewhere and cause excessive wear and or heat the olil - it usually traps air under block deck and one cylinder gets a hot spot and scores a bit and the oil boils off there.  2. Its one more thing to go wrong and get stuck closed  - most of us don't run 50/50 on antifreeze and don't swap it very often - and that part is considered a Consumable  - so you need to change it at sometime .  we let our cars sit more than street cars, so stuff like that gets stuck more often

Steam Ports confuse lots of people - GM and me included ...  they are there to ensure you don't get trapped air which is bad (see above)  especially in areas around valve guides that need to remain cool or the valve sticks open and well.. bye bye engine ....

But even GM sometime says  - you can plug them ... LS7 heads don't have them (most anyway)  Many aftermarket heads have the provison, but they are not drilled through and people like CBM just block them off. 

I put them in where the heads can take them  - its cheap insurance and a few well respected builders will not warranty heads that don't have them ....

By The Way - that little U hose on the water pump is not needed  - but it does not hurt  - when you run a Heater core it does the same thing - I just think its fast and clean to tap and plug them with Pipe plugs as @J Alper said - I have never done anything differently

 

[Kraut_n_Rice]

By The Way - that little U hose on the water pump is not needed  - but it does not hurt  - when you run a Heater core it does the same thing - I just think its fast and clean to tap and plug them with Pipe plugs as @J Alper said - I have never done anything differently

When you run a heater core there is a valve that stop flow through it.  When the valve is open the coolant flows through the core, effectively cooling it, then to the back of the water pump to be push through the engine.

How is the U not hot coolant out of the heads right back into the inlet of the water pump?

 

[Bobalos]

as you ( @Fullthrottleguy) mentioned, the intricacies of an LS cooling system are kind of complex, but it looks to me like if you put that jumper from the heater core nipples, it would remove a significant amount of water from the path that goes through the radiator.  it would be similar to drilling a 3/4" in hole in the freeze plug (the 1/4" hole and the 5/8" hose).  

I realize that it does that in a car, but in a car it has a good bit of tubing, and the heater core to limit the water flow and the heater core will remove heat, so its in essence going through a radiator.   

 

[Bobalos]

Oh dear lord....................  the collant valve for a 2004 GTO with a LS.  LOL

 

[Jtmoney714]

I’m confused a tad. And I’m not very well versed on the ls. Does that redline plug need to have holes drilled? To me it looks like it will plug the hole. 

 

[Fullthrottleguy]

When you run a heater core there is a valve that stop flow through it.  When the valve is open the coolant flows through the core, effectively cooling it, then to the back of the water pump to be push through the engine.

How is the U not hot coolant out of the heads right back into the inlet of the water pump?

as you ( @Fullthrottleguy) mentioned, the intricacies of an LS cooling system are kind of complex, but it looks to me like if you put that jumper from the heater core nipples, it would remove a significant amount of water from the path that goes through the radiator.  it would be similar to drilling a 3/4" in hole in the freeze plug (the 1/4" hole and the 5/8" hose).  

I realize that it does that in a car, but in a car it has a good bit of tubing, and the heater core to limit the water flow and the heater core will remove heat, so its in essence going through a radiator.   

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Its true - in most cases the heater control valve is closed unless the heater or defroster is on, and heater core is a small radiator .... In my younger years all my "hot rods" had a stock radiator and lots of HP and we always ran around with the heat on full blast to cool the car ;-) 

The "u" is not ideal and I don't do it, but when the heat is one (valve is open) but the blower is off (pretty common) - you are basically passing hot water back, albeit the heat is on because the air outside aka blowing over the radiator is cool, it's not a good idea  "short cutting the radiator" as you are saying ....

 

[Bobalos]

I’m confused a tad. And I’m not very well versed on the ls. Does that redline plug need to have holes drilled? To me it looks like it will plug the hole. 

Im guessing it depends on the rest of the system.  Im willing to bet that on my car it would not matter.  my radiator sits quite a bit higher than the motor, the filler neck is the highest point by a lot.  my motor has the steam tubes on the top of the heads, on the high side (the clutch side sits quite a bit lower than the WP side).  the steam tubes go back to the water pump so there is a place for the air to goto. 

when my steam tubes were plugged I could not bleed it for nothing.  When I fired up the motor I could look down the radiator & see that there was NO water flowing.  when I cleaned those steam tubes the second I fired the motor up I could see water flowing @ a VERY good rate, & I could see it burping the air out almost instantly. 

 

[Kansas T]

I use a stock thermostat in my car.  8 years and I've never had an issue.

 

[J Alper]

I feel the U, should be removed, I just think you want as much water going through the radiator as much as you can, 

I actually am really glad this discussion is going on, This is what this site needs,   when i do not see any sand car topics it really pushes me away from this site, a am glad there are so many questions and opinions on this topic, 

Now back to steam ports,  -- where i think it does not work, and i might be wrong, but i have seen cars with the steam ports only exiting out the back,  I think this would be against the natural flow of the water across the heads,  What is your guys thoughts on that,  

 

[Bobalos]

It make sense to me that they would go to the head space in the surge tank or into the radiator (which Ive seen before), but being in buggies, that is not always practical.  Hell my buggy did not have an overflow tank when I got it.  what was done on my buggy seems to make sense to me the lower 2 steam holes are plugged (the Clutch end) & the higher 2 holes (the water pump end) are connected together & then a hose goes to the water pump.  I did not look @ it in a lot of detail, but I assumed it went into the pump so it would get pushed into the radiator to settle out the bubbles. 

what I have not had a chance to do is look closely @ a set of heads & see if that really makes sense.  

what does seem strange to me is that the water goes into the block, up into the head, then back down into the block to go back to the water pump, to go out to the radiator...... 

 

[lincster]

I’m confused a tad. And I’m not very well versed on the ls. Does that redline plug need to have holes drilled? To me it looks like it will plug the hole. 

No. Install it and that’s it. 

 

[Kraut_n_Rice]

It make sense to me that they would go to the head space in the surge tank or into the radiator (which Ive seen before), but being in buggies, that is not always practical.  Hell my buggy did not have an overflow tank when I got it.  what was done on my buggy seems to make sense to me the lower 2 steam holes are plugged (the Clutch end) & the higher 2 holes (the water pump end) are connected together & then a hose goes to the water pump.  I did not look @ it in a lot of detail, but I assumed it went into the pump so it would get pushed into the radiator to settle out the bubbles. 

You would not put steam port hoses in your overflow UNLESS it is pressurized like the GM car the engine came out of.  If it's a simple burp type tank putting steam port hoses would vent all the pressure in the system.  Thus, making it more likely to boil the coolant.

 

[Bobalos]

You would not put steam port hoses in your overflow UNLESS it is pressurized like the GM car the engine came out of.  If it's a simple burp type tank putting steam port hoses would vent all the pressure in the system.  Thus, making it more likely to boil the coolant.

Agreed, which is why I put "surge tank" in the text, rather than "overflow tank", so it matched the picture. 

it would be kind of funny (& not) if it was plumbed into the overflow & it just kept moving it from the head/steam port into the overflow, into the sand. It would turn a pressurized system into an ambient system.  LOL.