Small Twin Turbos vs Supercharger - School me Please

Hondajimz said:
str8uptoytrader.com

Whipple 4.5 Supercharger

Whipple 4.5 Supercharger for LS7. Comes with a 8” lower pulley and an extra 3.5” top pulley. Great condition. $8,500. Contact @bjeskew or BJ (702) 885-3018. Located in Las Vegas, NV.
str8uptoytrader.com str8uptoytrader.com
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That is my Customer, Dirt Shades, we put that blower on Jody from VP fuels' Tatum,


Harrop will do a Rear Feed 2650, but do not know if Garry has it in him to figure out the tensioner system,
Real Looks and mid power is with a Whipple
Real Power and mid looks is with a 2650
 
J Alper said:
To much money at stake,
I always mix my fuel now, at worst i mix 4 gallons of 87 to 1 gallon of 110, to get 91 octane, most of the time i mix 3 gallons of 87 to 2 gallons of 110,
Even doing that a barrel lasts me all season,

I have built so many Turbo Motors, and i have done some true 90 octane motors, and you have to take so much compression out of the motor that it makes for a 6lbs max with under 9.1 com ratio, at that point just do a big Cube motor, my 468 walks away from a 6lb-8.5com motors,

One issue is air temps, a hot day with a lot of load in lower RPM's is going to detonate if the octane gets low, unless you have a octane tester you are playing with fire, if you get fuel at the same place and run out the 87 in the line and get pure 91 you can check the density, then check the density of the 87, and record that, then if the fuel sits, checking the density over time might save your motor,
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Have you tested 110 leaded to 87 or 91 unleaded? I was told by someone waaaaaaaaaaaaay smarter than me that actual MON increase from leaded fuel is more than the simple ratio (91.6 in your case) suggests.
 
I have no skin in this fight, but I used to run a Subie at 25lbs of boost, full boost was a rocket ship, but also a little undrivable.
 
J Alper said:
That is my Customer, Dirt Shades, we put that blower on Jody from VP fuels' Tatum,


Harrop will do a Rear Feed 2650, but do not know if Garry has it in him to figure out the tensioner system,
Real Looks and mid power is with a Whipple
Real Power and mid looks is with a 2650
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Thanks. I may contact seller if I can't make a deal on a rebuildable core I'm trying to get.

Looks are my least concern. I'm after decent power, predictable driveability, reliability and not a one off design that can't be easily serviced and repaired when necessary.
Good points on fuel quality. I may do some 110 add just to be on the safe side.
 
J Alper said:
That is my Customer, Dirt Shades, we put that blower on Jody from VP fuels' Tatum,


Harrop will do a Rear Feed 2650, but do not know if Garry has it in him to figure out the tensioner system,
Real Looks and mid power is with a Whipple
Real Power and mid looks is with a 2650
Click to expand...

That blower on Str8up sold awhile ago according to seller.
 
Hondajimz said:
str8uptoytrader.com

Whipple 4.5 Supercharger

Whipple 4.5 Supercharger for LS7. Comes with a 8” lower pulley and an extra 3.5” top pulley. Great condition. $8,500. Contact @bjeskew or BJ (702) 885-3018. Located in Las Vegas, NV.
str8uptoytrader.com str8uptoytrader.com
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Thanks for sending. Unfortunately it's an old ad and sold long ago according to seller. He's contacting Str8up to get it removed.
 
Have you looked into Kenne Bell Blowers? I ran one on a 416ci LS3 and it ran great, fullthrottleguy(Alex) turned me onto them and it was a great setup on 91 octane.
I now have a TT car with the same motor size and I have to say that I highly prefer the TT setup over the blower. Blower car on 91 just felt like a very strong NA motor and never really had that big wow factor. Dont get me wrong it had great power but in my opinion the TT car is a lot more fun to drive
 
HydroPower said:
Have you looked into Kenne Bell Blowers? I ran one on a 416ci LS3 and it ran great, fullthrottleguy(Alex) turned me onto them and it was a great setup on 91 octane.
I now have a TT car with the same motor size and I have to say that I highly prefer the TT setup over the blower. Blower car on 91 just felt like a very strong NA motor and never really had that big wow factor. Dont get me wrong it had great power but in my opinion the TT car is a lot more fun to drive
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My understanding is they don't really make anything really comparable to the 4.5 for an LS7
 
DarkSide said:
Not to derail this thread but planning to run pump gas on my tt setup. I'm hesitant to run E85 because of fuel consumption. What are you thoughts on 91 pump with VP additive? Race gas just keeps getting harder and harder to get in CA.

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Not sure what way you head to Glamis but, there is a new gas station off of Dillon Rd in Indio right off of SR-86 that has race gas at the pump. Red Earth casino also has race gas at the pump. They both use Sunoco 110. I think because they are on tribal land you do not have to sign a paper stating your racing.
 
Rockwood said:
Have you tested 110 leaded to 87 or 91 unleaded? I was told by someone waaaaaaaaaaaaay smarter than me that actual MON increase from leaded fuel is more than the simple ratio (91.6 in your case) suggests.
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I hope you are smarter than them, Yes if you go to Rocket, Rebel, Sunoco, or VP fuel site, it
is just a average, The owner of the new 4.5 is Jody, he the VP fuel station here,
Jody says to get octane do the average like the website lists, this will be close the average is a lower octane than what you would get so you are safe,
The Race fuel he sells is good for 2 years open and 5 years in the container sealed,

He also has a fuel station that sells pump fuel, the way it was explained is the 89 octane and the 91 octane comes from the same pump but not the same tank,
so depending how far each tank is, he uses a 3/4 line, the line has to be cleared before the other octane will be at the end of the pump,

Unless the person in front of you is getting 91 octane, then i am sure it will be a little less at the pump,


This is way more complicated math, but when you do a average the result is the same

Mixing Fuels and Calculating Octane

www.sunocoracefuels.com www.sunocoracefuels.com
 
DarkSide said:
Not to derail this thread but planning to run pump gas on my tt setup. I'm hesitant to run E85 because of fuel consumption. What are you thoughts on 91 pump with VP additive? Race gas just keeps getting harder and harder to get in CA.

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Speaking with Jody one of the owners of VP fuel station in Las Vegas,
that is for non performance octane boost,

for what we do he said use this one,

 
J Alper said:
I hope you are smarter than them, Yes if you go to Rocket, Rebel, Sunoco, or VP fuel site, it
is just a average, The owner of the new 4.5 is Jody, he the VP fuel station here,
Jody says to get octane do the average like the website lists, this will be close the average is a lower octane than what you would get so you are safe,
The Race fuel he sells is good for 2 years open and 5 years in the container sealed,

He also has a fuel station that sells pump fuel, the way it was explained is the 89 octane and the 91 octane comes from the same pump but not the same tank,
so depending how far each tank is, he uses a 3/4 line, the line has to be cleared before the other octane will be at the end of the pump,

Unless the person in front of you is getting 91 octane, then i am sure it will be a little less at the pump,


This is way more complicated math, but when you do a average the result is the same

Mixing Fuels and Calculating Octane

www.sunocoracefuels.com www.sunocoracefuels.com
Click to expand...
For unleaded race with unleaded pump (as exampled in the chart) yeah. He said the difference is Tetraethyllead is a better octane booster by volume than what is used in unleaded (which is probably why it was used), so that you end up with better MON values than averages would indicate.
 
One of the guys we used to dune with has twins on a 406 in his Tatum, it ran good when all was good but there were more days when it wasn't right and it ruined more than one dune trip for the group. It was professionally built and tuned. Had the engine out with the heads off a few times, retuned a few times, now he's building a new engine with aftermarket block although I don't know all of the details.

I just don't like turbos, a feel a supercharger is better all around for driveability. The torque down low is a better tradeoff vs making power at 6500.
 
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KLC said:
One of the guys we used to dune with has twins on a 406 in his Tatum, it ran good when all was good but there were more days when it wasn't right and it ruined more than one dune trip for the group. It was professionally built and tuned. Had the engine out with the heads off a few times, retuned a few times, now he's building a new engine with aftermarket block although I don't know all of the details.

I just don't like turbos, a feel a supercharger is better all around for driveability. The torque down low is a better tradeoff vs making power at 6500.
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Properly sized turbo won’t make power off idle, but definitely will make power from 2-5500 or 2500-6000rpm.

Even something as small as an LM7 will make over 600lbs at 3000rpm at only 10lbs of boost…

IMG_4208.webp

Boost doesn’t really change the underlying motor’s powerband, just elevates it. As long as the turbo(s) are sized correctly for the power, all is good.
 
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