Front Turning brakes

Kind of seems like a cutting brake plumbed to "right" or "left" with adjustable proportioning values on each side would be a pretty bitchen setup. Maybe located to the right and left of the brake so you could reach down and adjust the bias on the fly.. 

But....  it seems to me that anything designed to slow the car down would simply slow the car down.  Maybe something that allows it to turn with the loud peddle jammed to the floor would be the way to make the car faster.  

 
Years ago when Herzog’s were racing in  “SODA”. and short course truck was driven by Jimmy Johnson. They had a front wheel braking system, to help rotate the truck. Not sure how it worked but the brake was applied by how much the steering wheel was turned. 
 

I also think Rob Mac had something like this in his Nye Frank built short course truck that was eventually banned and the rule book was re-written because if that truck. 
 

In both cases these trucks had weight over the front and were able to use front brake steering when weight was transferred to the front end in a corner. With a buggy you have very little front weight transfer, and most tend to accelerate pushing the rear around to rotate. 
 

I say try it and see what happens, how it works or in what applications it works best. This is how innovation happens and how the greats find new things. Like what Mickey Thompson did. It was by trying things and seeing if it worked. The bypass shock was built by trying it. Now you all have to have them! 
 

Trivia, Mickey Thompson has been said to have the first by-pass shocks, on his Challenger car. But those were actually built by a guy named Rick Hazlo who later started Shock Tech. Not sure what happened to Rick? Heard drugs might have got into his life. Unfortunately that ruins allot of lives. 

 
John@Outfront said:
correct  two levers, but each lever is a single handle two position turning brake.  pull back on left lever =right rear brake, pull back on right lever= right front brake and so forth

pulling back on both levers would be a hard right
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I see no problem with  four brakes, having to think, which lever, which wheel, oh never mind. By the time I could get it figured out I would be back at camp. 

 
My idea of the turning brake is to slide the rear wheels to match the path & direction of the front wheels. A front turning brake might be helpful at low speed but with weight bias on the outside rear wheel the inside front wheel would have very little traction in the sand. So I'd assume you would use the outside front wheel to brake. I don't see it being very helpful in the sand and you would have to work the steering, rear turning brake & front turning brake in unison. Maybe some of the AWD technology used in the AWD class one cars would gain you some advantage turning in the sand. Lets see the first AWD Funco summer project.   

 
great input  you may not know but my car guaranteed has more front weight bias then "any" rear engine funco ever made.   im close to the weight distribution of a mid engine car, so this front turning brake may have more results then say a V8 funco that has less front weight distribution.  Pulling on the turning brake never slows me down, cause im on the gas at the same time.  that would go for applying the front brake too.

you may not have realized it, but if you are able to slow down the inside rear tire while making a right turn (say 5 mph), your left tire speeds up the exact same amount (given your rpm doesn't change)  what a hoot.  i love using the turning brake while under heavy throttle.

most funcos don't need turning brakes, but i want them to add an entirely different feel of 4 wheel drifting that you just cant get anywhere else

 
My turning brake is under my right foot and left hand.

 
I am not sure if the car would turn,   

there is so much positive traction in the rear, I think it would just push,  just like a tractor, 

or if you where on the gas, the front would be so light, i just dont think it would work, 

I really only use the TB if i am in a wheelie,  or side hilling, then i lock up one back and the front just magically goes uphill, 

I dont really use the turning brake to much,  I mostly chop on the throttle to get the rear sliding around,     

 
Mine being mid engine I found TB never got used. I removed it and never feel I've missed it.

 
I’ve seen some of the SXS guys in my group run these front tires that are 1/2 razor and 1/2 paddle in the front…. I think that would probably help with the turning break idea.  But as Alper said, there is so little force on the fronts I don’t think it’s going to be tremendous but it could be just enough to get the car turning harder.   

 
John@Outfront said:
some of you should do stand up comedy, (i would go)

my wifes car has lane assist that applies both brakes on one side to "pull" you back in the lane.  it works pretty nice and yes that is applying the brakes on the turning wheel.

i dont think locking up a single turning wheel on the inside would be a big deal.

so none of you think it could would to any advantage (in the sand)  i may have to just try it.  my first idea would be to have a second turning brake right along side my normal brake, just with a shorter handle.  if i want both wheels on one side to brake i would effectively grab both handles , if not then just grab the regular rear only
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If you're trying to drift, engaging both brakes on one side would do the opposite, and the lane assist is the perfect example of it: safety systems would never engage to "spin" a car (what a drift feels like to Joe Schmoe).  It would just jink the car over, but most likely do it perfectly straight.

Just one front brake plus throttle might accomplish what you're looking for since you're providing a resistance point for pivoting, but there's not much load on the inside front even on your car under throttle while turning, so it might just skip.

But, hey, don't knock it til you try it.  Let us all know how it works and we'll copy you or laugh, depending on the result :biggrin:

 
Update:

Talked to RJ momentarily about his dual brake pedal in the Pro2 truck which is not how I assumed it worked. Only runs rear brake or all 4 depending on what pedal is pushed. 

Turns out, all you need is a 410 spec motor and a light rear end to get the thing to turn. Whood a thunk it?

He wouldn't let me drive it though. Even with the promise of a few beers on me after we got off the beach.

IMG_4727.JPG

IMG_4729.JPG

 
Sean@Weddle said:
Update:

Talked to RJ momentarily about his dual brake pedal in the Pro2 truck which is not how I assumed it worked. Only runs rear brake or all 4 depending on what pedal is pushed. 

Turns out, all you need is a 410 spec motor and a light rear end to get the thing to turn. Whood a thunk it?

He wouldn't let me drive it though. Even with the promise of a few beers on me after we got off the beach.

View attachment 6868

View attachment 6869
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That last pic needs to go in the roost thread

 
I have driven a car at Glamis, with too much brake bias to the front brakes.  The car had triple razors on the front, and when the brakes were hit hard, and the tires locked up it threw sand in the air.  It was pretty annoying.  I would think the ease of locking up the front tire, would make it a regular thing, and I assume it would just throw that sand up in the air and your face.

I'm intrigued, but I don't see it working.  My $.02.  Let us know John!!

 
2dasand said:
I have driven a car at Glamis, with too much brake bias to the front brakes.  The car had triple razors on the front, and when the brakes were hit hard, and the tires locked up it threw sand in the air.  It was pretty annoying.  I would think the ease of locking up the front tire, would make it a regular thing, and I assume it would just throw that sand up in the air and your face.

I'm intrigued, but I don't see it working.  My $.02.  Let us know John!!
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I can say with pretty good certainty that Outfront hasn't had sand thrown up in his face before.  He might end up liking it you never know.

 
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this system would not be used in an all open drift, big dunes it would be when dicing through some tight stuff, i dont think most of you could even relate  i mean really tight stuff    i think it would be limited use but just another trick in the machine.  i will be trying it..........catch me if you can  to be continued. 

 
John@Outfront said:
this system would not be used in an all open drift, big dunes it would be when dicing through some tight stuff, i dont think most of you could even relate  i mean really tight stuff    i think it would be limited use but just another trick in the machine.  i will be trying it..........catch me if you can  to be continued. 
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