Your opinions and your feelings do not matter

HozayKwarvo

HozayKwarvo

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How do the greens most frequently shut down off-road recreation areas? Sierra Club and Center for Biological Diversity (CBD) and many others have been successful in closing riding areas across the nation by using the rules and regulations to their advantage… and getting paid to do it!

The Federal Lands Recreation Enhancement Act (federal law) allows groups to get reimbursed their legal fees in cases they win against the government and the federal land managers (like BLM). The CBD is basically a group of lawyers that get paid (reimbursed their own fees) by winning litigation against government agencies for not managing the public lands.

The ISDRA is managed with the Recreation Area Management Plan (RAMP), NEPA, CDCA, etc and other federal regs taken into account.

When the BLM or any other federal land manager doesn’t uphold the requirements of the RAMP (and other regs) they can be sued for non-compliance. Getting sued takes time and money… time and money that should be used managing the lands and complying with the regulations …so they get stretched thing while fighting litigation and …start circling the drain… as resources get thin they likely miss a few additional requirements, get sued again… essentially bankrupting the agency from being able to effectively manage the lands, then the gates get closed and the recreation area is no more.

It’s more technical than that, but in a nutshell, anything that diverts resources away from the already bureaucratic and inherently inefficient federal land managers puts our riding area at risk.

Intentions do not matter. When it comes to litigation it’s not subjective, it’s black and white - compliant or non-compliant.

 
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Do I think a teeter-totter or a rainbow dinosaur are going to shutdown the dunes? No, I don't.

Do I think that someone is eventually going to get hurt by some man-made un-permitted object placed in the dunes and sue the BLM? Yes, I absolutely do.

Permitting these things isn't smart. Once the BLM accepts it they accept the responsibility. What happens when a federal agency has a written mandate to maintain something? ...they have to plan and budget for that. That takes time, energy, and bodies. We already have the pads, bathrooms, dumpsters, and wash road grading that we pay for. Who wants to add more amenities to pay for? Not to mention, if it isn't properly maintained and someone gets hurt it's a slam-dunk lawsuit.

You think BLM is going to knock down that kiddie track in wash 6? Hell no and I wouldn't want them to... then next season after the BLM levels it and the heathen children recreate the damned thing someone else will wad it up and blame the BLM for not maintaining it... they'd be asking to get sued for leveling out kiddie tracks and ultimately miss one or not be able to keep up... and I wouldn't want them spending OUR money on OUR land to maintain that crap.

The concept that it's the mad-Max wild-wild-west, every man for himself and to hell with everyone else, do what you want how you want and let everyone else suffer... it's not just what is wrong with Glamis, it's what is wrong with our country. Very little common decency and respect for one another or our society and code of laws.

 
HozayKwarvo said:
Do I think a teeter-totter or a rainbow dinosaur are going to shutdown the dunes? No, I don't.

Do I think that someone is eventually going to get hurt by some man-made un-permitted object placed in the dunes and sue the BLM? Yes, I absolutely do.

Permitting these things isn't smart. Once the BLM accepts it they accept the responsibility. What happens when a federal agency has a written mandate to maintain something? ...they have to plan and budget for that. That takes time, energy, and bodies. We already have the pads, bathrooms, dumpsters, and wash road grading that we pay for. Who wants to add more amenities to pay for? Not to mention, if it isn't properly maintained and someone gets hurt it's a slam-dunk lawsuit.

You think BLM is going to knock down that kiddie track in wash 6? Hell no and I wouldn't want them to... then next season after the BLM levels it and the heathen children recreate the damned thing someone else will wad it up and blame the BLM for not maintaining it... they'd be asking to get sued for leveling out kiddie tracks and ultimately miss one or not be able to keep up... and I wouldn't want them spending OUR money on OUR land to maintain that crap.

The concept that it's the mad-Max wild-wild-west, every man for himself and to hell with everyone else, do what you want how you want and let everyone else suffer... it's not just what is wrong with Glamis, it's what is wrong with our country. Very little common decency and respect for one another or our society and code of laws.
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And dat one Hozay, is going into the McScrappbook. 

 
A woman was hit and killed at the drags a few years ago and they haven't shut that down. Or is that not a 'destination? 

 
L.R.S. said:
A woman was hit and killed at the drags a few years ago and they haven't shut that down. Or is that not a 'destination? 
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Jeffe, you know I’m a big fan but I’ma funna disagree. A better analogy could be that like the memorials, any trash left behind after the drags is / are man made objects that are in direct violation of our agreement to recreate. 

 
L.R.S. said:
A woman was hit and killed at the drags a few years ago and they haven't shut that down. Or is that not a 'destination? 
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I think you're reaching a little here bud. There's a difference between a gathering and a destination. Is there a gate? Is there a "Christmas tree"? Is there a fixture marking the lines where the drags start and stop? If you ride in to the path of the drags you're either 1) completely oblivious to your surroundings or 2) you're a complete effing idiot. Probably the latter... if you come over a dune and crash into an object that wasn't there last week because someone decided they wanted a "destination" to ride to, that's probably not your fault and is clearly unsafe. :cheers:  

 
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The drags are analogous to the kiddie tracks. If a group of off-roaders freely gather to run the hill or blast through a patch of sand that's pretty standard to what off-roading is. The BLM may shut down the gathering of people at some point, same as closing the hill on a rowdy night - but they wouldn't even consider putting out cones/fence or anything that would formally acknowledge or maintain that activity and area. The second that they did they'd be "sanctioned" and the BLM would be liable for them and anything that happened there.

 
I was going to say something but the TOPic said enough. Peace

 
GPS Coords to the Glamis Ramp?

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Honestly, it's refreshing to have a RAMP / ISDRA knowledgeable person back actively on GD... @HozayKwarvo

So much of the Social Media crap has made its way from IG and FB to Community based forums.

 
Crusty said:
GPS Coords to the Glamis Ramp?



Honestly, it's refreshing to have a RAMP / ISDRA knowledgeable person back actively on GD... @HozayKwarvo

So much of the Social Media crap has made its way from IG and FB to Community based forums.
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For sure, we need to keep our eye on the ball with all of this.  We still need to support the ASA some way, their membership is cheap.  Buy your season pass from them (and you get to write it off), become a supporting member, or just be an advocate online and in your camp.  

 
I came in here to express my feelings and concerns. Peace

 
My only concern is how I can get back to Mother G.....................great weather and fun times last weekend

 
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