Oil pressure low at idol

Kingkong

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So after I swapped to an ls3 last season I noticed sometimes after a decent run say from Olds to swing set my oil pressure at idol would be at 5 to 10 I've never seen it that low not even with my ls1. Should I try a different oil ? I even changed sending unit and gage same thing. Any ideas?

 
I believe this is a typical problem off the LS platform.  The O ring around the pickup at the bottom of the pan goes bad.  Will have to drop the pan and replace.  I guess what happen is under low idle, it struggles to get a good suction, like you are seeing.  But under load, it is fine.  I would start there.

Jonathan  

 
How is the pressure being read? Sender unit? Try installing a mechanical gauge and see what it reads. 

 
Yes sir those auto meter sending units I've never really liked em. 
You can get a small mechanical gauge for like $40 and install it down by the oil filter. Should be a 1/8" plug there. 

 
Synthetic or Petroleum?

I noticed a drop when I went to synthetic. 

 
As LRS said you should use a mechanical gauge and measure at the Oil filter adapter near the pan this is directly on the main oil rail and will be the most accurate as to what the mains see. 

You can also test at the plug near the front of the engine (where a lower alternator would be) this will show you direct pump output ...

But unfortunately I think you are going to find the numbers are pretty close to what you are seeing on the electric gauge when the engine is warm. 

LS's in general have oiling issues -  the OIL pump runs off the crank and turns the speed of the crank  and therefore unlike many other engines  that turn off the CAM  its hard to get a oum that is efficient at low rpm and does not cavitate at high RPM  -  they also have the limitation that if you use a High pressure spring in the pump it just changes the pressure the pump bypasses rather than regulates the pressure across the RPM rabge like a small block chevy or other engines. So changing the spring does nt give you more pressure at idle.  

Its also true that the Pickup design is not ideal -  as mentioned above it uses an O-ring and suck air if the O-ring is bad  - but they hardly go bad - that problem usually happens after a rebuild because the wrong o0ring is put in (there are 4 colors and it confusing). Or Very high mileage engines the oring can split - but thats Very unusual.

More commonly the engines just have bad clearances - most commonly casued by someone putting a clutch on an engine that was an automatic and center thrust bearing now has more ckearance - sometimes you can even see this by Pushing in the clutch at idle and watching the OP drop by 3-5 or more  lbs. 

Using a heavier oil can band aid the problem and hide a clearance issue - MAYBE -  I have seen it work sometimes and not many times .

Its also common for LS's to overheat the oil and they thin out - thats an easy test - if you change the oil ad the pressure is good for the first few hours the problem is heat

The oil pumps also wear an they get sloppy, so changing to a new better pump (a blueprinted pump is the best way to go  -( JALPER does those here on GD) the pump usually helps a little (assuming you get the right o-ring ...)  and going to a high volume pump - always brings the pressure up 10-20lbs - BUT you have to be really careful to keep the Oil always full because you can suck a 5 quart pan dry on extending High rpm runs.   

The Hi Vol pump is not really a band aid as the bearing usually don't get hammered out in 10-20K miles after the pressure drops, but its ALWAYS an indicator something is going wrong.  A Hi pressure pump is fine as well because it will increase the pressure at higher RPM but again be careful sucking the pan dry -   Do that 2 or 3 times and you will wioe the bearings ...

When I have changed to a Hi Vol Pump with an F body or 5 quart pan I always Install an Oil cooler it privides an extra couple quarts in the system and I never saw a problem after that ... it also cools the oil which stops it thinning out 

One more thing  - Most engines NEED 10Lbs mimimal at Idle 10 Lbs per 1000 RPM  to be safe -  the LS really needs 15 at hot idle and  50Lbs is fine up to 7500RM 

People constantly chase LS oil pressure issues (I have too) and its really stressful and often not a great outcome if you let it go FWIW

 
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As LRS said you should use a mechanical gauge and measure at the Oil filter adapter near the pan this is directly on the main oil rail and will be the most accurate as to what the mains see. 

You can also test at the plug near the front of the engine (where a lower alternator would be) this will show you direct pump output ...

But unfortunately I think you are going to find the numbers are pretty close to what you are seeing on the electric gauge when the engine is warm. 

LS's in general have oiling issues -  the OIL pump runs off the crank and turns the speed of the crank  and therefore unlike many other engines  that turn off the CAM  its hard to get a oum that is efficient at low rpm and does not cavitate at high RPM  -  they also have the limitation that if you use a High pressure spring in the pump it just changes the pressure the pump bypasses rather than regulates the pressure across the RPM rabge like a small block chevy or other engines. So changing the spring does nt give you more pressure at idle.  

Its also true that the Pickup design is not ideal -  as mentioned above it uses an O-ring and suck air if the O-ring is bad  - but they hardly go bad - that problem usually happens after a rebuild because the wrong o0ring is put in (there are 4 colors and it confusing). Or Very high mileage engines the oring can split - but thats Very unusual.

More commonly the engines just have bad clearances - most commonly casued by someone putting a clutch on an engine that was an automatic and center thrust bearing now has more ckearance - sometimes you can even see this by Pushing in the clutch at idle and watching the OP drop by 3-5 or more  lbs. 

Using a heavier oil can band aid the problem and hide a clearance issue - MAYBE -  I have seen it work sometimes and not many times .

Its also common for LS's to overheat the oil and they thin out - thats an easy test - if you change the oil ad the pressure is good for the first few hours the problem is heat

The oil pumps also wear an they get sloppy, so changing to a new better pump (a blueprinted pump is the best way to go  -( JALPER does those here on GD) the pump usually helps a little (assuming you get the right o-ring ...)  and going to a high volume pump - always brings the pressure up 10-20lbs - BUT you have to be really careful to keep the Oil always full because you can suck a 5 quart pan dry on extending High rpm runs.   

The Hi Vol pump is not really a band aid as the bearing usually don't get hammered out in 10-20K miles after the pressure drops, but its ALWAYS an indicator something is going wrong.  A Hi pressure pump is fine as well because it will increase the pressure at higher RPM but again be careful sucking the pan dry -   Do that 2 or 3 times and you will wioe the bearings ...

When I have changed to a Hi Vol Pump with an F body or 5 quart pan I always Install an Oil cooler it privides an extra couple quarts in the system and I never saw a problem after that ... it also cools the oil which stops it thinning out 

One more thing  - Most engines NEED 10Lbs mimimal at Idle 10 Lbs per 1000 RPM  to be safe -  the LS really needs 15 at hot idle and  50Lbs is fine up to 7500RM 

People constantly chase LS oil pressure issues (I have too) and its really stressful and often not a great outcome if you let it go FWIW
All good to know thanks Alex its a new damn motor with 4 trips on it so I'd hope it's nothing u mentioned I might have to take it by the builder just to make sure its all good and I'm just trippin lol

 
Get one of these... I was tripping on my new to me TT LS2 with one season on it. Replaced the sender etc...thought it was low because I was seeing 35 on cold start on my dash gauge and around 10 after warm up and hard run. The mechanical is a lot more accurate and shows more like 45 on a cold start... climbs to 60-80 with some revs, and the  goes to around 15-20 idle after a long hard run!  I spoke to Kolby @ turnkey who assured me That this was perfectly fine / normal.

6405419B-5718-4BB2-B01E-C193588C6414.jpeg

 
All good to know thanks Alex its a new damn motor with 4 trips on it so I'd hope it's nothing u mentioned I might have to take it by the builder just to make sure its all good and I'm just trippin lol
I am sure that you will have 15 or more on a gauge with the right oil and thats OK.  BUT Definitely bring it to the builder's attention or  they will not support you if there is a problem later.. and ask them what oil and weight they recommend. Most "race type" builders like loose clearances  - arguable but generally safer - and that means running heavier 20w-50 oil.  vs factory 0w-20 oil.

I personally only run synthetics  - I like clean internal engines  and if an LS cannot tolerate Synthetic oil you have bigger issue with the engine

With a new engine while you are at it did you install an oil catch can?  Always a good thing to start with on a new build

 
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I am sure that you will have 15 or more on a gauge with the right oil and thats OK.  BUT Definitely bring it to the builder's attention or  they will not support you if there is a problem later.. and ask them what oil and weight they recommend. Most "race type" builders like loose clearances  - arguable but generally safer - and that means running heavier 20w-50 oil.  vs factory 0w-20 oil.

I personally only run synthetics  - I like clean internal engines  and if an LS cannot tolerate Synthetic oil you have bigger issue with the engine

With a new engine while you are at it did you install an oil catch can?  Always a good thing to start with on a new build
I was told.5w30 no catch can but it's on the list now. 👍

 
Get one of these... I was tripping on my new to me TT LS2 with one season on it. Replaced the sender etc...thought it was low because I was seeing 35 on cold start on my dash gauge and around 10 after warm up and hard run. The mechanical is a lot more accurate and shows more like 45 on a cold start... climbs to 60-80 with some revs, and the  goes to around 15-20 idle after a long hard run!  I spoke to Kolby @ turnkey who assured me That this was perfectly fine / normal.

View attachment 12152
Gonna have to go see Kolby as well lol that's who I got this motor from 

 
IMO 5W30 is too light. 
 

Everyone in my group runs Valvoline 20W50. Even in stock motors. 
When my motor was stock I never saw below 30psi even after a hard run. 
 

i did install an oil cooler after my rebuild. 
I installed a gauge and saw a 50 degree drop in engine oil temps after I added the cooler. 

 
I know it's expensive but would a dry sump system be a better way to go.  Like a Dailey? With the money I have invested to the engine, I'm seriously considering it.  I'm sure the engine builder would love to sell one but, I'd like to hear what others think 

I also run 20-50 , an external filter (Wiks Racing) qnd cooler with fans. 

 
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20w50 on a stock motor is going to make heat for little (if any) benefit. If you’re making 15psi ish at idle and the appropriate 10psi/1000rpm, or your builder specified that weight, you’re just shredding the oil until it’s hot enough to flow properly. Since engines use oil to cool bearings, pistons and other internal parts as much as lubricate them, beware. 

Factory tolerances are tight. Shoving molasses through the motor just slows the oil down and forces the pump to shed volume through the bypass spring. 

 
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So after I swapped to an ls3 last season I noticed sometimes after a decent run say from Olds to swing set my oil pressure at idol would be at 5 to 10 I've never seen it that low not even with my ls1. Should I try a different oil ? I even changed sending unit and gage same thing. Any ideas?
Which brand sender/gauge is it? Have you checked the wiring, sender, and gauge? I had a VDO gauge die last season where it read 20-40 psi low. Idle: 0, high RPM, 30-40. Thought the motor was dead, but noticed that it was below 0 with the engine off and gauge on. 

Should be able to ohm out the sender to find out if it’s kaput. 

 
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Autometer gauge  with the typical autometer sender 

 
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